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	<title>Comments on: Hitler, Bush and Historical Accuracy</title>
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	<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/</link>
	<description>Proud member of the vast liberal conspiracy</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 10 May 2012 14:20:48 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: TheRanter</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6205</link>
		<dc:creator>TheRanter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 May 2012 14:20:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6205</guid>
		<description>The issue is not what Bush said - that&#039;s well documented. The issue is that nobody has a source for the Hitler quote, which seems to have been invented more or less out of thin air as a scare tactic. As a historian, I resent that, even if I agree with the aims of the people who invented the quote.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The issue is not what Bush said &#8211; that&#8217;s well documented. The issue is that nobody has a source for the Hitler quote, which seems to have been invented more or less out of thin air as a scare tactic. As a historian, I resent that, even if I agree with the aims of the people who invented the quote.</p>
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		<title>By: MrWmnHtr</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6204</link>
		<dc:creator>MrWmnHtr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 May 2012 07:21:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6204</guid>
		<description>&quot;Our nation has been put on notice: We are not immune from attack. We will take defensive measures against terrorism to protect Americans. Today, dozens of federal departments and agencies, as well as state and local governments, have responsibilities affecting homeland security. These efforts must be coordinated at the highest level. So tonight I announce the creation of a cabinet-level position reporting directly to me--the Office of Homeland Security.&quot; ~ George Bush
Source: The Test of our Times, by Tom Ridge, p. 25 , Sep 1, 2009 

It&#039;s not exact but the subject matter is exactly the same. I got this quote and the citation from OnTheIssues.org on this page: http://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/George_W__Bush_Homeland_Security.htm</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Our nation has been put on notice: We are not immune from attack. We will take defensive measures against terrorism to protect Americans. Today, dozens of federal departments and agencies, as well as state and local governments, have responsibilities affecting homeland security. These efforts must be coordinated at the highest level. So tonight I announce the creation of a cabinet-level position reporting directly to me&#8211;the Office of Homeland Security.&#8221; ~ George Bush<br />
Source: The Test of our Times, by Tom Ridge, p. 25 , Sep 1, 2009 </p>
<p>It&#8217;s not exact but the subject matter is exactly the same. I got this quote and the citation from OnTheIssues.org on this page: <a href="http://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/George_W__Bush_Homeland_Security.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.ontheissues.org/Celeb/George_W__Bush_Homeland_Security.htm</a></p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6203</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Apr 2012 14:09:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6203</guid>
		<description>Hi!

First of all thanks for the effort so far.
I stumbled upon this discussion as many other did at researching the quotes. Although the discussion is quite old^^

On my quest I found this source regarding Hitler.
The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, 1922-1939, Vol. 1 (London, Oxford University Press, 1942), pg. 871-872

Unfortunately I couldn&#039;t check it on google books because of limitations of use.
Because German is my native language I would also like to find a German quote + Source. If anyone has anything in that direction I would appreciate it very much.

Thanks again</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi!</p>
<p>First of all thanks for the effort so far.<br />
I stumbled upon this discussion as many other did at researching the quotes. Although the discussion is quite old^^</p>
<p>On my quest I found this source regarding Hitler.<br />
The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, 1922-1939, Vol. 1 (London, Oxford University Press, 1942), pg. 871-872</p>
<p>Unfortunately I couldn&#8217;t check it on google books because of limitations of use.<br />
Because German is my native language I would also like to find a German quote + Source. If anyone has anything in that direction I would appreciate it very much.</p>
<p>Thanks again</p>
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		<title>By: TheRanter</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6202</link>
		<dc:creator>TheRanter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Mar 2012 19:48:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6202</guid>
		<description>I talk too much? Well, who was it that forced you to read this?

Is the quote right or wrong? Well, if you&#039;re still asking that, then you read too little and you have not understood this article.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I talk too much? Well, who was it that forced you to read this?</p>
<p>Is the quote right or wrong? Well, if you&#8217;re still asking that, then you read too little and you have not understood this article.</p>
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		<title>By: Neal</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6201</link>
		<dc:creator>Neal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Mar 2012 18:34:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6201</guid>
		<description>So, is the quote right or wrong? You talk far too much. Yet my answer has yet to be answered.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, is the quote right or wrong? You talk far too much. Yet my answer has yet to be answered.</p>
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		<title>By: johnny schaefer</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6182</link>
		<dc:creator>johnny schaefer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Oct 2011 05:18:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6182</guid>
		<description>very good, thank you!  The documentary Zeitgeist also quotes this in a comparison to Hitler.   
I believe it was originally a case of generic/synonyms translation.  What&#039;s another way of saying State... kind of situation.  
It&#039;s interesting to note that FDR mentioned homeland 3 times in fireside chats but only in regards to other countries.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>very good, thank you!  The documentary Zeitgeist also quotes this in a comparison to Hitler.<br />
I believe it was originally a case of generic/synonyms translation.  What&#8217;s another way of saying State&#8230; kind of situation.<br />
It&#8217;s interesting to note that FDR mentioned homeland 3 times in fireside chats but only in regards to other countries.</p>
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		<title>By: TheRanter</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6174</link>
		<dc:creator>TheRanter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Apr 2011 16:00:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6174</guid>
		<description>Well, I owe you a major apology then! I completely misunderstood. No excuse for jumping to conclusions except to say that what you don&#039;t see is the large number of comments I get from people who are simply trying to use the comments to sell stuff. I delete those right away, so others don&#039;t have to see them and I guess it conditions me to see things that aren&#039;t there.

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa! Please forgive me.

In my normal work as a historian, I do excatly as you mention - you find a snippet with a poor citation and you start using Google Books which is just amazing and see if you can find the original. I also have access to some full-text databases through my university that are subscription only. I don&#039;t know the ones for 20th century Germany so I haven&#039;t really looked there.

The problem is that every citation I&#039;ve found is like the one that you give, but I&#039;ve seen at least four different dates and the context varies. It&#039;s either the day after the Reichstag fire, or the day the Gestapo was formed or whatever, but using my usual methods, I&#039;ve never been able to find anything of the sort.

Anyway, so I should have thanked you for your comment, and now I do. And I feel a bit embarrassed by the misunderstanding so again, please accept my apologies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I owe you a major apology then! I completely misunderstood. No excuse for jumping to conclusions except to say that what you don&#8217;t see is the large number of comments I get from people who are simply trying to use the comments to sell stuff. I delete those right away, so others don&#8217;t have to see them and I guess it conditions me to see things that aren&#8217;t there.</p>
<p>Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa! Please forgive me.</p>
<p>In my normal work as a historian, I do excatly as you mention &#8211; you find a snippet with a poor citation and you start using Google Books which is just amazing and see if you can find the original. I also have access to some full-text databases through my university that are subscription only. I don&#8217;t know the ones for 20th century Germany so I haven&#8217;t really looked there.</p>
<p>The problem is that every citation I&#8217;ve found is like the one that you give, but I&#8217;ve seen at least four different dates and the context varies. It&#8217;s either the day after the Reichstag fire, or the day the Gestapo was formed or whatever, but using my usual methods, I&#8217;ve never been able to find anything of the sort.</p>
<p>Anyway, so I should have thanked you for your comment, and now I do. And I feel a bit embarrassed by the misunderstanding so again, please accept my apologies.</p>
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		<title>By: Scootle</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6173</link>
		<dc:creator>Scootle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:58:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6173</guid>
		<description>Wow, you completely misunderstood the point of me posting that. That wasn&#039;t my book. I, like you, am simply someone pissed off with unsourced quotes.

I once bought a biography on Albert Einstein just to see if I could find sources for any of the quotes that are attributed to him on the internet. The few quotes I found in the biography had citations like &quot;Letter to ___, 1901&quot; or whatever. So then I found a book of raw material with those letters in, which I cross referenced to verify some of those quotes.

Now, thanks to Google Books, I can do that to an extent for free on the internet. Which is what I was trying to do with that Hitler quote. That book I posted was literally the only one I could find that actually gave some form citation with a date, so I thought it was worth posting here to point people in a direction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, you completely misunderstood the point of me posting that. That wasn&#8217;t my book. I, like you, am simply someone pissed off with unsourced quotes.</p>
<p>I once bought a biography on Albert Einstein just to see if I could find sources for any of the quotes that are attributed to him on the internet. The few quotes I found in the biography had citations like &#8220;Letter to ___, 1901&#8243; or whatever. So then I found a book of raw material with those letters in, which I cross referenced to verify some of those quotes.</p>
<p>Now, thanks to Google Books, I can do that to an extent for free on the internet. Which is what I was trying to do with that Hitler quote. That book I posted was literally the only one I could find that actually gave some form citation with a date, so I thought it was worth posting here to point people in a direction.</p>
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		<title>By: TheRanter</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6172</link>
		<dc:creator>TheRanter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Apr 2011 04:11:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6172</guid>
		<description>[NOTE: I thought Scootle was citing his own book and trying to sell it here. I jumped to that conclusion b/c I&#039;ve had a lot of people use the comments to try to sell something. Given his/her followup explanation, I&#039;ve edited this comment to make more sense in that context and apologize to Scootle for jumping to that conclusion rather than saying thanks for the contribution. So Scootle - thanks!]

Sadly, this book like the others I have found has only a vague reference to a &quot;speech to the German nation, 28 February 1933&quot;. This is essentially the same &quot;citation&quot; I&#039;ve seen many times, though commonly the date varies. Furthermore, your quote is in English, so it is obviously not from a primary source.

A true citation would cite the source where the historian found the information. Did the author see an actual film in German or a recording of an actual radio broadcast in German of this speech that he/she accessed at some archive? If so, give the archive call number so that others can verify the source. This is how history is done. If not, did he or she find a source from the period that does quote this, in German and that is contemporaneous with the event (that is, a news report from March 1, 1933)? Then the author must give the publication name, date, publishing information and page number. 

No, he or she don&#039;t have that either? Then at the very least I would like to see the author cite the secondary source referenced, giving author, title, publisher info, date, and page reference. This would already not be considered quality history, but it is sometimes done. However in the case of a commonly cited quote of Montaigne, I tracked this down to a misquote in a book by Philippe Ariès, then repeated by Lawrence Stone and then by many others, so we prefer primary sources, but a secondary source, if well-documented, can be used in informal circumstances, though it can&#039;t be considered authoritative.

Since this speech mentioned in that book you cite would have occurred the day after the Reichstag fire, such a speech may well have been made, but what is the source? What is the original? How does the author know it isn&#039;t a bastard translation of the Reichstag Fire decree from that same date? If it is not, where can I find the full text of the speech, in German, from a contemporaneous source, or a serious historian who has seen a recording of the original and excerpted bits.

I&#039;ve seen this date mentioned (and others), but as yet have not been able to find mention of any speech given by Hitler on that day. There was &lt;a href=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verordnung_des_Reichspr%C3%A4sidenten_zum_Schutz_von_Volk_und_Staat&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Verordnung des Reichspräsidenten zum Schutz von Volk und Staat&lt;/a&gt; (the Reichspresident&#039;s order for the protection of the people and the state), but the Reichspresident was Hindenberg, not Hitler, and though an oppressive order, it does not contain the language constantly mentioned in these articles comparing Hitler to Bush. That same say, Hindenberg (and signed by Hitler) issued a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.documentarchiv.de/ns/1933/hochverrat_vo.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Verordnung des Reichspräsidenten gegen Verrat am Deutschen Volke und hochverräterische Umtriebe&lt;/a&gt; (Reichspresident&#039;s order against the betrayal of the German people), but again I don&#039;t find anything about &quot;evil&quot; (Böse) threatening the &quot;homeland&quot; (Heimat, probably?). A few days later Göring did give a speech titled &quot;Kampf gegen Chaos&quot; (Struggle against Chaos), but the language of the quote is &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.geschichtsforum.de/attachments/f66/7635d1243952240-rede-hermann-g-ring-img.jpg&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;not in that speech either&lt;/a&gt;.

So the quest continues... and until then, I will assume this quote is bogus</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[NOTE: I thought Scootle was citing his own book and trying to sell it here. I jumped to that conclusion b/c I've had a lot of people use the comments to try to sell something. Given his/her followup explanation, I've edited this comment to make more sense in that context and apologize to Scootle for jumping to that conclusion rather than saying thanks for the contribution. So Scootle - thanks!]</p>
<p>Sadly, this book like the others I have found has only a vague reference to a &#8220;speech to the German nation, 28 February 1933&#8243;. This is essentially the same &#8220;citation&#8221; I&#8217;ve seen many times, though commonly the date varies. Furthermore, your quote is in English, so it is obviously not from a primary source.</p>
<p>A true citation would cite the source where the historian found the information. Did the author see an actual film in German or a recording of an actual radio broadcast in German of this speech that he/she accessed at some archive? If so, give the archive call number so that others can verify the source. This is how history is done. If not, did he or she find a source from the period that does quote this, in German and that is contemporaneous with the event (that is, a news report from March 1, 1933)? Then the author must give the publication name, date, publishing information and page number. </p>
<p>No, he or she don&#8217;t have that either? Then at the very least I would like to see the author cite the secondary source referenced, giving author, title, publisher info, date, and page reference. This would already not be considered quality history, but it is sometimes done. However in the case of a commonly cited quote of Montaigne, I tracked this down to a misquote in a book by Philippe Ariès, then repeated by Lawrence Stone and then by many others, so we prefer primary sources, but a secondary source, if well-documented, can be used in informal circumstances, though it can&#8217;t be considered authoritative.</p>
<p>Since this speech mentioned in that book you cite would have occurred the day after the Reichstag fire, such a speech may well have been made, but what is the source? What is the original? How does the author know it isn&#8217;t a bastard translation of the Reichstag Fire decree from that same date? If it is not, where can I find the full text of the speech, in German, from a contemporaneous source, or a serious historian who has seen a recording of the original and excerpted bits.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve seen this date mentioned (and others), but as yet have not been able to find mention of any speech given by Hitler on that day. There was <a href=http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verordnung_des_Reichspr%C3%A4sidenten_zum_Schutz_von_Volk_und_Staat" rel="nofollow">Verordnung des Reichspräsidenten zum Schutz von Volk und Staat</a> (the Reichspresident&#8217;s order for the protection of the people and the state), but the Reichspresident was Hindenberg, not Hitler, and though an oppressive order, it does not contain the language constantly mentioned in these articles comparing Hitler to Bush. That same say, Hindenberg (and signed by Hitler) issued a <a href="http://www.documentarchiv.de/ns/1933/hochverrat_vo.html" rel="nofollow">Verordnung des Reichspräsidenten gegen Verrat am Deutschen Volke und hochverräterische Umtriebe</a> (Reichspresident&#8217;s order against the betrayal of the German people), but again I don&#8217;t find anything about &#8220;evil&#8221; (Böse) threatening the &#8220;homeland&#8221; (Heimat, probably?). A few days later Göring did give a speech titled &#8220;Kampf gegen Chaos&#8221; (Struggle against Chaos), but the language of the quote is <a href="http://www.geschichtsforum.de/attachments/f66/7635d1243952240-rede-hermann-g-ring-img.jpg" rel="nofollow">not in that speech either</a>.</p>
<p>So the quest continues&#8230; and until then, I will assume this quote is bogus</p>
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		<title>By: Scootle</title>
		<link>http://takenforranted.com/hitler-bush-facts-93/comment-page-1/#comment-6171</link>
		<dc:creator>Scootle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Apr 2011 07:49:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://takenforranted.com/2007/10/21/hitler-bush-facts/#comment-6171</guid>
		<description>We have a citation...

[Scootle orginally gave a link to a book that attributes this vaguely to an address to the German nation on 28 February 1933 as a hypothesis for further investigation. I misunderstood and thought he was another spammer trying to sell his book in my comments and deleted the link. Sorry Scootle. In any case, the important piece there is the date, since the book itself offered no meaningful citation and I did at least preserve the date, though as I mention above it&#039;s only one of a few dates I&#039;ve seen put forth. Apologies for deleting the link]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We have a citation&#8230;</p>
<p>[Scootle orginally gave a link to a book that attributes this vaguely to an address to the German nation on 28 February 1933 as a hypothesis for further investigation. I misunderstood and thought he was another spammer trying to sell his book in my comments and deleted the link. Sorry Scootle. In any case, the important piece there is the date, since the book itself offered no meaningful citation and I did at least preserve the date, though as I mention above it's only one of a few dates I've seen put forth. Apologies for deleting the link]</p>
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